Loxjie P20 Balanced 6N3 Tube Hybrid Amp for under $100


#202

Btw, i been running my P20 with IFI 12V iPower and it definitely sounds better with it vs. the stock brick.
the IFI unit tests better than some LPS: https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/topic/31119-power-supply-8-group-test-lps-and-smps/


#203

The LED controller chip seems to be a clone of the TM1650:

https://os.mbed.com/components/TM1637-LED-controller-32-LEDs-max-Keyboa/

Wonder if I can just drop in a replacement daughterboard with its own 7-segment, 3 digit LED based on the TM1650.


#204

The amp has 12 input. You sure you are not underpowering it?


#205

ty. was a typo :slight_smile: was typing 9v as the link and review was for the 9v.


#206

Just to be certain, your iFi power unit is 9V, and it works well the P20?

(thanks)


#207

He is using the 12 volt as is a fellow over on SBAF with a noise nuke. Expect some startling measurements soon.


#208

Thanks. Looked there but couldn’t find it. Probably not looking in the right place…

But no one answered the key practical question in thread above: for use w/the P20 w/o underpowering it (or blowing it up), which voltage iFi Power is optimal–9V or 12V?

(thanks)


#209

It uses a 12v smps so a 12v Ifi would do. There will be a measurement post soon using an ifi and noise nuke. I don’t know if lab supplies were also used but you will get a good evaluation of power supplies and amp performance. I expect it to get favorable results (got a sneak peek). Wait until you read the post and then decide if a 12v ifi is right for you.


#210

I’m using the 12V.


#211

Thanks to you & @kerplunk for helping me understand this alternate power supply topic.

Do you hear any sonic difference w/the iFi 12V vs stock switching power supply?


#212

Yeah, I need more info before I’ll drop $50 on a $100 amp – and an amp that’s making me happy already.


#213

I have a noise nuke built from my time with my Ember, just waiting on the nuclear review due any day now…I expect our ears to be confirmed and then some, Always comforting to have a little science confirm what you already know.


#214

I realize this is somewhat controversial but I’ve owned/used both the Senn 600s and 650s. When times were tight and I needed cash, I simply couldn’t part with the 650s so the 600s sadly, had to go.

As you make you own cables I think the added SQ “weight” of the 650s when compared to the 600s will appeal to you.

Either pair of cans, to my ears at least, had their particular “deficiencies” and strengths well managed by a custom cable.

I used a Cardas copper cable with the 600s but a solid silver braided & balanced cable with the 650s. Perhaps a balanced copper cable with the 600s would have evened things up a bit more, but I only had the silver balanced and the 600s didn’t benefit from the added brightness in the top end.

But the silver cable brought out the highs in the 650s that some say seem “veiled” (hate that term in reference to newer, “silver driver” Senns) without affecting any bass depth or impact. I found a cheaper silver plated cable and even a lesser silver cable (lower gauge) to negatively impact the bass frequencies. It certainly didn’t seem to be placebo to me.
That combination sounds so “right” that I simply would not give up these HD650 cans with the balanced silver cable regardless of what else I’ve heard or might buy in the future (and I’ve heard plenty of “technically better” headphones ). One man’s rather firm opinion :smirk:

I also like the HD58X but the 650s balanced are my go to when well amped as they are more refined and coherent, especially when pushed.


#215

My meeting in Miami was postponed so I am waiting to either reschedule or for a colleague to fly across with the HD6XX. I am certainly looking forwards to giving them a try.

I have never been a believer of cables and sonic qualities, as long as the cable is of good quality (and I have been doing audio installs for over 20 years). However, recently I put a silver braided cable on the ED16’s and it became far too harsh for me, so I had to revert back to the standard cable. I haven’t gotten around to trying that same cable on anything else yet…


#216

Not too sure what to make of the two statement, as they seem at least somewhat contradictory.

If…

Then how…

Unless you meant that for 20 years you heard no difference…until you tried that particular silver cable?

At any rate, I used to firnly believe it was strictly placebo. If you had a proper gauge for the signal, what difference could it possibly make?

But your experience with the “harshness” I think is similar to what I heard when trying the high quality silver cable with the 600s (which are more treble “forward” than tbe 650s). They just didn’t need or benefit from the accentuated top end. In fact it sounded worse than the SE Cardas copper cable.

We all use different words at times to describe what we hear, with both negative and postive aspects/nuances of sound.

Your “harshness” might be described as sibilance or “accentuated treble” by some. It’s hard to say without defining terms.
And even then, without listening to the same thing, at the same time and through the same gear, it’s hard to know exactly what someone is hearing/trying to describe when giving an opinion.

One thing I do know, which surprised me a great deal many years ago is the first time I had to admit that I heard a consistent, discernible difference with a better headphone lead.
It was the Cardas used with the 600s and I couldn’t deny at the time (neither could the person I was testing this with) that the Cardas cable “filled out” the sound of the 600s over the stock cable; and to a degree that could be picked out nearly every time.

Obviiusly, it is mire easily discerned with certain tracks/recordings than others.

It’s obviously up to you; you either hear a differebce or you don’t (and it’s either placebo or not).
But if I’d written off silver cables after listening to the lower quslity cables I first tried, I would have missed out on the great sound I’ve been happy with for several years now.
I hate “plugging” stuff and I’m sure there are many great cable compsnies out there. But the one that changed my mind and had me put money down, was a “Toxic Cables” branded “Silver Poison” balanced cable.
I have no affiliation whatsoever with the company and only bought the one cable “used as new”.

I think it’s kind of a dumb name but it’s a great sounding, well made cable.
Also, if we’re judging by or speaking of dumb names for audo gear…Crack/Speedball has to take the cake!

But apparently it’s a great amp, regardless of how many people who smoked crack and then shot an actual “speedball” have dropped dead!

I hope you get to hear something you like enough without having to spend too much money and time.

Good luck.


#217

Bottlehead Crack is awesome, still the best sounding amp I have ( might be biased due to putting it together myself), I still need to put the Speedball on it.

I’ve experienced the silver cables harshness before, I determined the issue to be a bad mastering of a track I was using at the time. But I’m no electrical engineer, so I can defer to others with better knowledge than me on the topic. But I could tell a slight difference between the silver cables and OFC cables, especially when audio quality wasn’t the greatest the silver cables came off harsher, not as smooth as the OFC.

But at the end of the day, whatever makes you happy as long as you aren’t treading on me…


#218

This agrees with what I’ve read and experienced. Silver is a better conductor than copper and apparently does a better job with the narrow and weak signals in the high range. Now, this may or may not show up in gross overall output, but it’s a widespread observation.

A silver plated cable made my KZ IEMs go from bright to ridiculous. The same cable works fine on TRN V80s.


#219

GThe only advantage I’ve heard/experienced personally with silver is opening up the treble a bit on the 650s. And certainly not with all silver cables. I know very littke about cable construction, so have to go by what I can hear.
Flexibility, durabilty and a lack of microphonic transfer is important to me as well. These types of things are great to be able to share at meets; something I’ve been unable to do for some time now.

I’m certainly no expert and definitely heard the harshness of which you guys speak with a couple of lesser (SE) silver cables, even on the 650s.
As mentioned, I nearly gave up when someone who raved about/loved their SP Toxic cable decided to get a newer, lower gauge/thicker version of the same brand.
I was truly as surprised as I was pleased. I’m the first one to sell something (or not buy it in the first place) if I feel/hear there’s not a good cost to performance benefit ratio…something which is likely apparent in some (many?) of my posts :roll_eyes:
To be honest, I wish I hadn’t heard a positive difference; It would have been cheaper!
I haven’t looked for years now to see if the company is even stil in business.
It was a going concern for some time over on head-fi. At the time, there were long waits and (tentatively) rising prices (although not nearly as high as some boutique companies).

Come to think of it, I’d heard a custom silver cable with some 650s that I liked at a meet. So the quest to find a decent affordable one began there. Toxic Cables was highly thought of and used many different materials in their cables (ie not just silver).

This thread has me curious to see if the company is still around…think I’ll go take a look.

Yep… but his cables appear to be out of my league at this point. Just delete if the link below is inappropriate (like anyone needs my permission :wink:
As I bought mine second hand, I never even dealt with the owner…so hardly have a stake in the guy!s company (also, I think I might have to re-think my “not as expensive” observation…oh well.
Anyway, iI’s just info…https://www.toxic-cables.co.


#220

That is (sort of) what I was saying.

For over two decades I have been working in live audio, I started off as a performer on stage, branched out into studio work and then have mostly done live sound and permanent installs (theatres, performance lounges etc) since the end of the 90’s.

In all these years I have experienced a lot of differences in cables when comparing cheap crappy cables against decent cables, however, once into a “decent level” cable, I have never really experienced any benefit between one or another. I am also a bass player and have experienced again a lot of difference between certain cables (treble roll off on coiled cables etc.) but as I make my own, I have not been able to notice any difference between two brands of decent cables (or connectors).

When I experienced such an extreme difference in sound with the ED16’s between the stock cable and the replacement, I was pretty shocked. I mean, I could understand the silver cable making some difference due to it being a different overall impedance, but not to the extent that it was.

I am sort of thinking that it is the stock cable of the ED16 that is not of a decent quality and it just so happens that I prefer the sound signature that way (missing treble) and don’t like the real sound of them, but until I try the cable on other IEMs I won’t know.


#221

I was more on the retail record & home listening end of things but quality of construction, proper guage and OFC was always what seemed important.

I never even heard of using a material other than copper for audio transmission until I honed in on headphone listening more (about 2006 or so).
I always liked good headphones but they were pretty much for when you couldn’t turn up the speakers!
I topped out at the AKG-340 hybrids back in the seventies but didn’t have dedicated headphone gear back then.
Used the 340s when I began a sound engeneering course in Vancouver (twice) back in the 90s (some still preferred the less expensive 240s for the studio).

But health issues got in the way both times, so it never went where I’d hoped.
C’est la vie…you can’t always get what you want.